Judo vs. Jiu jitsu

[jitsu1234]

Hello,

Which of these two arts better prepares a person for real life self defence? Any thoughts?

Cheers

[JackG]

jitsu for the one reason that judo is the sport version of jiu-jitsu , its jitsu with all the nasty bits taken out so it can a competition sport

judo originated from Jitsu

[Akai Shizuku]

Ju-jitsu is definately better for self-defence. As stated above, Judo is more of a martial sport. Ju-jitsu training also includes weapons like tanto.

[Shinobi_Kokujin]

I dont believe Judo and Jiujitsu can be compared like that.

it comes down to one's personal preference on which of the two they may like to train in.

cause Jiujitsu has a Sport competition side to it also. they both have devastating techniques.

some of the more traditional Jiujitsu schools may have more in depth than Judo.

and Both arts are combat Proven and tested in Law Enforcement and Military Special Forces etc.

[Akai Shizuku]

True, true, but you'd have to have a very unique style or already trained in Judo for it to be more effective for you than Ju-jutsu.

[Spinach]

I'm gonna go against the grain here and say Judo.

Why do I say this? Is it because I like the debate that will follow such a statement? Well, a bit.

In Judo you practice against resisting, struggling opponents. In a large majority of Jujutsu schools the techniques are unresisted or minimally resisted. Despite an more indepth approach a JJ student is still screwed if he isn't testing his skills against real opponents on a constant basis. Until that is fufilled you might as well go to a dance class during the day and read a self defense book at night.

To back up what I am saying, I know these five security guards. Two do Jujutsu, three do Judo. The Jujutsu guys are all high ranking guys who know their stuff(I know..)and are technically brilliant who have been at it for five and four years. None of them cross train.

The Judoka kick ass whenever they are attacked. They have never been seriously injured and on most occasions have been able to detain the attacker for later arrest by police. The Jujutsu guys used to get punched and kicked and thrown to the ground when they started the job. One of them was mature enough to say that his training didn't prepare him for a real life situation and it was through trial and error on the street that helped him develop himself and the style to suit his needs. The Judo guys didn't have this problem. This might also explain why more military guys do Judo then Jujutsu.

To sum up, to have effective Jujutsu you would need a very unique style or have already trained in Judo


Note: Jujutsu is a great martial art. The question wasn't about personal ability and previous training experience, just self defense value from a pure stylist.

[N.B]

Originally Posted by Spinach

In a large majority of Jujutsu schools the techniques are unresisted or minimally resisted. Despite an more indepth approach a JJ student is still screwed if he isn't testing his skills against real opponents on a constant basis. Until that is fufilled you might as well go to a dance class during the day and read a self defense book at night.

I don't know what martial art you're talking about there, I went to a Jitsu (foundation) class and it was 50% throwing people attempting to strike you, and 50% grappling with resisting opponents (usually going to ground), and that wasn't a one-off lesson. Type in 'jitsu nationals' on youtube and you'll probably get 1/2 throwing, 1/2 groundwork and grappling.
Judo is exactly as JackG said: Jitsu with the nasty bits taken out, so if it's got it in Judo, it'll have it in Jitsu.
Although I suppose there is a slight difference, because apparently judo relies a lot more on brute strength to take an opponent down.

[Shinobi_Kokujin]

Some jujutsu schools have what N.B described . the traditional ones. but there are a lot that do

what Spinach Described while most Judo schools train against resisting opponents.

Judo doesnt really rely on brute strenght. but yeah the bigger an strongers Judoka are gonna have an edge in the Strenght department and use it.

Judo goes along the same guidlines as BJJ & Combatives such as if your rolling with an opponent an your tired an exhausted from using your strenght then your not Grappling properly cause minimal strenght and not much energy should be expended
unless neccessary


I vouch for both styles about equally cause they both do a pretty good amount of damage even if jujutsu has more in depth techniques.

[Ben]

In my taijutsu classes we do jujutsu as part of the hand to hand combat. Its effective, but it doesnt work without the nasty bits

acctually what you will find in lots of jujutsu is that if yoyu do the nasty bits properly then the opponents norammally to weak or distracted to resist anyway.

The reason more police use jusdo is because judo is great for a policman as it retains the attacker without causeing them great harm. If the police used jujutsu too much then lots of prisoners would have missing eyes, or severe groin pains for many years


I do think its important to train with resisting opoenet, we do grappling and fre fighting in taijutsu so we learn to apply our techniques.

To sum up.. jujutsu was good enough for the ninja.. its good enough for me

[serge1234]

Hello,

I agree that practicing with a resisting opponent is the only way to truly prepare yourself for real world scenarios. I`ve never tried Judo, but from what i understand i`m sure its better than jiu jitsu. I`ve trained in japanese jiu jitsu classes before and i cant see the co-op training i did there being beneficial, alot of the jiu jitsu guys i know are kidding themselves about the effectiveness of their skills, some of them even consider thai boxing and BJJ ineffective in the real world because they are sports, which is nonsense.

Could you imagine a boxer or MMA fighter training exclusively against non-resisting opponents? I know boxing and MMA is not the same as the fighting on the street, however, i doubt anyone honestly believes boxers and MMA fighters would struggle to defend themselves in a real situation.

[JackG]

PEOPLE PEOPLE PEOPLE, its about the club not the style ! please don't generalize not all clubs are without non resistant opponents .
Blame the CLUB not the style

[Akai Shizuku]

Originally Posted by JackG

PEOPLE PEOPLE PEOPLE, its about the club not the style ! please don't generalize not all clubs are without non resistant opponents .
Blame the CLUB not the style

Wow, I was just about to post the same thing. After reading everyone else's posts after mine, your conclusion is the same as mine. And it's not just the club, it's your own personal fighting style.

[Spinach]

Originally Posted by Akai Shizuku

Ju-jitsu is definately better for self-defence. As stated above, Judo is more of a martial sport..

Originally Posted by Akai Shizuku

True, true, but you'd have to have a very unique style or already trained in Judo for it to be more effective for you than Ju-jutsu.

Originally Posted by Akai Shizuku

Wow, I was just about to post the same thing. After reading everyone else's posts after mine, your conclusion is the same as mine. And it's not just the club, it's your own personal fighting style.

Eh? Oh, I get it. Jujitsu is better. Is that what you're trying to say? You don't make judgements based on style at all. That is, if it is in your styles favour. Otherwise you are quite happy to take the club out of the equation. Not hypocritical at all.

Originally Posted by N.B

I don't know what martial art you're talking about there, I went to a Jitsu (foundation) class and it was 50% throwing people attempting to strike you, and 50% grappling with resisting opponents (usually going to ground), and that wasn't a one-off lesson. Type in 'jitsu nationals' on youtube and you'll probably get 1/2 throwing, 1/2 groundwork and grappling.
Judo is exactly as JackG said: Jitsu with the nasty bits taken out, so if it's got it in Judo, it'll have it in Jitsu.
Although I suppose there is a slight difference, because apparently judo relies a lot more on brute strength to take an opponent down.

Speaking of its about the club not the style, really? Judo relies on brute strength? Enlightening.

Yes, I've seen the strikes practiced at jujutsu schools. Its a joke. Just like Aikido students running at each other with their arms in the air screaming "THROW MEEEE!!". At the end of the night, Jujitsu schools, though there may be a few exceptions, don't practice real sparring. Y'know, where their is no set outcome or a particular move to be performed. No attacker and defender. Just two guys trying to put the other guy down. Thats real resistance.

If your school ever gets the local Boxing or Muay Thai clubs down to help practice your defense against striking, let me know.


Ben. Full respect to you, but do you know what the charges are for taking out someones eye or rupturing their testicles? There is real self defense and there is fantasy self defence. Since you're english lets say you are down at the local nightclub(Since every english martial artist seems to spend their time at nighclubs and dangerous pubs) and someone gets annoyed for some reason and attacks you. You use the nasty bits and take him down, buised throat, ruptured eyes, half of his left ear is hanging off, snapped a finger. He didn't know when to lie down and kept coming back for more. You leave the club. Good self defence. Next day the police are knocking on your door wanting a word with you. Now you have a record. Now your spending time in a lockup. Now you are wondering whats gonna happen next. Maybe it wasn't such great self defence after all. Real self defence is putting someone down without severly damaging them. The nasty bits were great for ninjas and samurai but these days they will do you more harm then good if you use them on someone.

Also I understand the police bit, but how does that explain a military preferance for Judo? That is, my friends in the American army have expressed a military preferance, and my mates in the Aussie army have said very similar things. Ninjutsu and Jujutsu come into the equation much less often. Actually, ninjutsu never comes into it. Maybe there is something to it?


Serge1234 is right on with everything he said, plus rep. Competion stylist are hardly at odds on the street. A rattled brain will put your opponent down regardless of a lack of knowledge of forbidden jutsu.


I've just been stirring the pot but Shinobi Kokujin has been right on the ball the whole time. I have really enjoyed reading your contributions. Plus rep. No further detail required.


On accounts that the nasty bits are useless in real life, and that it seems Jujutsu needs to use them for full effect, and that Judoka train for maximum effectivness without the nasty bits, it would seem that Judo isn't as unrealistic as some people have portrayed it to be.

Jutsu1234, you should go with what Shinobi Kokujin has said. Both styles have their perks and both have an equal potential for street effectivness.

[Akai Shizuku]

[quote=Spinach;33566]Eh? Oh, I get it. Jujitsu is better. Is that what you're trying to say? You don't make judgements based on style at all. That is, if it is in your styles favour. Otherwise you are quite happy to take the club out of the equation. Not hypocritical at all.




Speaking of its about the club not the style, really? Judo relies on brute strength? Enlightening.

QUOTE]

I was merely changing my mind. Is that a crime?

[Stato]

I would say Jiu jitsu yep definatly Jiu jitsu. But i have got a mate who is Euro Judo Champ going to give him a fight this summer could be messy and he might win but hopefuly not . Some nice strikes first should get him then hopefully a bit of ground fighting just have to make sure no throws or im sunk lol.