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Styles: Budo, Shotokan, Hun Gar, Bujinkan (current)
Posts: 13
Home Country:
Ninjutsu chat
Hi Lads,
I dont wish to interrupt or appear rude, I have studied Bujinkan Budo Taijutstu since 1989, We have nine schools within our system, one of which is "Tagaki Yoshin ryu Jutaijutsu" which, apart from grappling, locks, chokes, throws, breakfalls, rolls, etc, stresses the importance of "Taking" or stealing the opponents balance, from beyond his awareness, (His blind side) in order to achieve maximum effect by minimum effort,(Oh!, and Practice), sos for sounding geeky, but it is so absorbing, even now I have a real fire in my soul, every time we train, even the Kihon Happo, (Basic Eight)ish?, its a buzz coz you do it different every time, and then add a hanbo, or a dash of mindstealing (distraction dudes). I`ll shut up now then.
Strangely, I almost have to agree with you here. It would seem that has one purpose.
So, it is a wonder how could it ever be accepted as a martial art lacking morals and virtues of others.
Well I can't answer for, John, but I did study ninjitsu and it was explained to me as this. Ninjitsu, some schools anyway, were orginated by peasants and conscripted soldiers. Others by yamabushi, mountain warrior mystics and still some by samurai schools. The samurai schools were hardset on the killing, nuinjitsu was a military art. No different from bujitsu, jujitsu, kenjitsu etc.
The peasant and yamabushi clans were too small to be a military force, so the idea was strike were it counted. Which is the assassin stuff and avoiding an attack otherwise.
But, you do realize almost all martial arts are just about fighting/killing, the -do concept of budo is only about 100 years old.
Well I can't answer for, John, but I did study ninjitsu and it was explained to me as this. Ninjitsu, some schools anyway, were orginated by peasants and conscripted soldiers. Others by yamabushi, mountain warrior mystics and still some by samurai schools. The samurai schools were hardset on the killing, nuinjitsu was a military art. No different from bujitsu, jujitsu, kenjitsu etc.
The peasant and yamabushi clans were too small to be a military force, so the idea was strike were it counted. Which is the assassin stuff and avoiding an attack otherwise.
But, you do realize almost all martial arts are just about fighting/killing, the -do concept of budo is only about 100 years old.
Yeah, I was hoping someone would respond in this fashin.
Indeed, just about every martial art is about fighting/killing, hence the martial of it.
In a nut shell, ninjitsu is avoid first and fight last, when you there is no honor in violence so honorible combat doesn't exist. If honorable combat is a myth then anything goes and do what it takes to win.
In a nut shell, ninjitsu is avoid first and fight last, when you there is no honor in violence so honorible combat doesn't exist. If honorable combat is a myth then anything goes and do what it takes to win.
Nijitsu wasnt about honor, fair, avoid, fight last......
Nijitsu wasnt about honor, fair, avoid, fight last......
It was; it was just a different cultural norm.
I know Pearl Harbor is a wretched example, because it was aimed at a US target. But look at the way the kamikazis were treated---almost like royalty/martyrs. They, according to the Japanese, died with honor. It should be noted that samurai codes of living, and Bushido, had a revival during WW2. It's very strange to Westerners, but not to those of us raised in that tradition.
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The essence of the tiger spiritual is contained in the habitual instinctual.--GS Takeshi Ukeno
I don't know about the first two things (especially fighting fair), but it was most definitely about avoidance and fighting last. Ninjas were spies. Most of the time, their job was much more effective if they caused their damage politically/socially. If they got into a fight with every guard they encountered, the entire castle/town would know that a ninja was in the area, and would take steps to prevent the spread of propaganda.
When they did assassinate, they preferred not to fight at all (again, I don't really see this as fighting fair, but I don't see it as uncalled for, either, given the era), but rather end their opponent's life without even an outcry.
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"I don't have the knack of victory at all times. I have only learned how not to miss the right moment." Kenshin Uesugi
"If you confer only with people in your own circle (relatives and friends), their opinions will naturally favor you, rendering them useless." Tsunetomo Yamamoto
"In true dialogue, both sides are willing to change."
Thich Nhat Hanh
I know Pearl Harbor is a wretched example, because it was aimed at a US target. But look at the way the kamikazis were treated---almost like royalty/martyrs.
Um, there were no kamikaze used in the attack on Pearl Harbor.
Nijitsu wasnt about honor, fair, avoid, fight last......
In some ways you 100% bujitsu systems of ninjitsu were about "covert ops" not open "overt warfare" so they were considered dishonorable. Same way the British concidered our forefathers hiding behind trees when they fired as dishonorable. But for example, Hanzo Hatori was both ninja spy chief and samurai lord.
On the flip side, the yamabushi were against violence in all forms but found the only way to survive was to fight back. To them everyone you harmed or killed was a black mark on your karma. So sending 1000 warriors to battle on the "honorable field" of battle was a greater black mark then sending one to kill a general or noble lord. To the yamabushi, they were the honorable ones.
More so, to the peasant ninja clans who were just trying to survive, it was never about honor or dishonor but just staying alive. A farmer conscripted to be an Ashigaru (foot soldier) was in all honestly better off conscripted as a "shinobi scout."
Personally I like the idea of their being more honor in a controlled strike at an enemy target. Something to consider...
ninjitsu basic moves?
confused:
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