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If that is his goal in life to go and train with him who am I or anybody to tell him any different. If he sees him as a creditable instructor to teach some fighting maneuvers let him do it its his life, his money, and his time to do what he wants with it. Now I'm not going to lie there are instructors that I will never train with and see as fakes like The Human Stun Gun Tom Cameron whoever learns from him in my eyes is wasting their time and will get killed for trying those "touchless knockouts". But there are going to be people who will approve of their training and see benefits from actually learning their style despite the stereotypes and what other stylists tell them. So to prevent a "my style is better than yours" mentality I say if you can find a benefit from studying a certain style that you find interesting and can improve your fight game study it. As the old saying goes knowledge is power and what works for him isn't going to work for me or anyone else. (Like I see no point in studying Capoeira but I know a few people who told me personally that they see Capoeira as a good style to study so its all really personal preference.)
Where do you train Muay Thai at in Lake Station? I know the area very well.
P.S. it is our responsibility as martial artists to hold frauds like this accountable.
Triangle, my mother came here during the Vietnam War Refugee Run and I was taught from my aunt's cousin Andy (can't spell his last name its Laotian) and it was what he remembered before he came here while he stayed in Laos. I don't train in Muay Thai anymore because I don't have the money to go to Elkhart, IN. anymore with the budget I'm working with now.
Triangle, it isn't going to do any good they are never going to go away and they are always going to be teaching people this stuff because they believe it works. Use Tom Cameron and George Dillman as an example there is proof that Kyusho Jitsu doesn't work and "touchless knockouts" don't work but there are still people lining up in front of their dojos waiting to learn from them. Just let them found out for themselves that it isn't going to work who cares and who knows the guy might be the next Lyoto Machida so why knock it ? Also you can't knock Ninjitsu all of the way neither because Jeremy Horn is a Black Belt in Ninjitsu from Robert Bussey Warrior International. So if he studied it before he got into MMA he must have of found something useful in Ninjitsu that most people haven't seen yet. Let me provide some videos on Tom Cameron and you tell me if they are ever going to be going away me personally it won't just let them found out for themselves what is real and what ain't.
Bryan, its your choice what you want to do with your life. If your dream is to go to Japan to study with Jinchi Kawakami who the Japanese government acknowledges as a living ninja descendant and you got the money to do it go on ahead. Life is short and if you're happy while doing it that is all that really matters in the long run.
Wow... The ignorance of people never stops amazing me... I have trouble believing that these guys are serious...
Malimusho, I see that you have a TKD background on your profile and hopefully you know what I'm talking about or seen it yourself. There are people who knock Tae Kwon Do as well and say its useless but there are people like Gung Le, Bas Rutten, and Stephen Bonnar who have Tae Kwon Do backgrounds and are successful fighters. Which further proves my point you can study whatever style and as many styles as you can then you will always find someone saying something negative about the style or styles that you studied. Who cares anymore what style the person studies as long as it works for them and they want to study it let them study it.
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Bryan, I'm sorry I can't tell you anything about ninjitsu instructors. Just do your research and look at what anyone tells you with a critical eye.
ronin, as REAL martial arts instructors it is absolutley our responsibility to point out the frauds. Otherwise, people who do not know any better fall for thier schemes then paint us all with the same brush strokes. If someone still wants to study with someone who the martial community has called a fraud then that is thier decision and it is an informed decidion. Even worse, people who don't know any better go to these fakes and think they are learning to protect themselves when in reality all they are learning is fantasy projection. Then they get hurt when they need what they were wanting to learn in the first place.
Because he is claiming to teach impossible things like magic. Even if he is just using it metaphorically for otherwise effective techniques, it shows that this guy is more interested in selling you the myth of ninjas than anything else.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ronin7411
Triangle, it isn't going to do any good they are never going to go away and they are always going to be teaching people this stuff because they believe it works. Use Tom Cameron and George Dillman as an example there is proof that Kyusho Jitsu doesn't work and "touchless knockouts" don't work but there are still people lining up in front of their dojos waiting to learn from them. Just let them found out for themselves that it isn't going to work who cares and who knows the guy might be the next Lyoto Machida so why knock it ? Also you can't knock Ninjitsu all of the way neither because Jeremy Horn is a Black Belt in Ninjitsu from Robert Bussey Warrior International. So if he studied it before he got into MMA he must have of found something useful in Ninjitsu that most people haven't seen yet. Let me provide some videos on Tom Cameron and you tell me if they are ever going to be going away me personally it won't just let them found out for themselves what is real and what ain't.
Keep in mind, that no one is knocking ninjitsu here. Rather, we are knocking anyone who teaches the use of psychic powers for combat usage because it is just as ridiculous as the people you mentioned (and knocked).
Additionally, it is our right and responsibility as educated martial artists to advise people what kinds of schools they should and should not consider to best suit their martial art interests (especially when they ask). It is not beneficial for anyone to simply allow people to "find out for themselves" by getting scammed when we have the ability to prevent it for obvious reasons.
To the original poster: I would advise you not to get caught up on studying ninjitsu specifically. First and foremost, consider what it is you are looking for in a martial art (fitness, competition, self defense, etc). Then, survey all the MA schools near you and ask to take an intro class (or at least watch one). Take note things you like and dislike about the school, especially the things that fit your preset goals and the quality of the higher ranking belts. Be sure to ask the head instructor about pricing. Now, take all your notes and consider if there are any schools that meet your goals that are within your budget. No need to move to Japan unless you really want to.
I'll admit to it Chapel that I'm putting my own foot in my mouth for knocking Dillman International for their teachings of using physic powers in combat. But as instructors or highly competent martial artists do you guys agree with me that no matter how many times you tell people that this person is bad and a fraud people still will go and train with them because they believe that they can do it too even with the evidence that it won't work in sport or actual combat ?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronin7411
I'll admit to it Chapel that I'm putting my own foot in my mouth for knocking Dillman International for their teachings of using physic powers in combat. But as instructors or highly competent martial artists do you guys agree with me that no matter how many times you tell people that this person is bad and a fraud people still will go and train with them because they believe that they can do it too even with the evidence that it won't work in sport or actual combat ?
So that means we should just stop trying to weed out the frauds or give advice to prospective students of the martial arts? That sounds like a terrible idea. Yes, some people will have to learn the hard way. however, some people will actually listen to good advice when they hear it. Under that way of thinking, none of us would be teachers because that one student that wouldn't listen and eventually quit. Your thinking on this makes no sense to me.
WC Lun, you actually said it if they choose to listen to the advice that you give them it helped them and it saved their life. If they choose to still go about believing into an illusion that will never happen let them get hurt for doing so. There is enough information out here in the world regarding certain styles of the martial arts with Youtube and the internet that people could draw their own conclusions on certain styles.
Joeemoplata, I'll admit to it my Combat Tai Chi background was at a church with an instructor that was out of his mind (plus he was an alcoholic that would show up to class drunk) and it never ever worked in a fight I got into. (I found that out the hard way that not all of your instructor's teachings will work for real life) That was why I quit training with him and started training with my aunt's cousin Andy in Muay Thai because its real and it has been proven to work. I personally study martial arts for two reasons one of them is yes self defense because I definitely would like to know how to handle myself when there is a knife or a gun pulled out on me. The second reason is for competition/sport I wouldn't doing some competitions and earning a few trophies and belts to show off my athleticism. You guys are right that you have the right to deter people from studying a martial arts system that is going to get you killed or seriously injured. But sometimes you're better off letting the person find out just like the way I did with Combat Tai Chi that some of the teachings from that certain instructor is completely useless by actually getting their butt handed to them for trying to use it. If they can successfully apply it in combat hey they found something that works for them but there is only one way that you will ever know if the style you are studying will ever work in combat that is if you actually use it in combat.
I personally study martial arts for two reasons one of them is yes self defense because I definitely would like to know how to handle myself when there is a knife or a gun pulled out on me.
You need to join the track team to learn how to handle yourself when confronted with a knife or gun because the best defense is to RUNNNNNNNNNNN
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and what works for him isn't going to work for me or anyone else. (Like I see no point in studying Capoeira but I know a few people who told me personally that they see Capoeira as a good style to study so its all really personal preference.)
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