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Other Martial ArtsDiscuss other martial arts here - such as Capoeira, Savate, Fencing, and Western Martial Arts, etc.
Capoeira isn't really about combat. Some techniques from Capoeira can be assimilated to create an effective martial art, but not Capoeira in itself. Can you win a bar-fight with it? Probably not; most moves take time and space, though some techniques are very effective and resemble San Shou take-downs.
Capoeira is a game. Though it does incorporate combat, it's more akin to a game or dance. Think Dance Dance Revolution. It's a game about dancing, but everyone knows that nobody dances that way; the same with Capoeira, it's a martial art that is performed through dance, but no one fights that way.
Capoeira is about rhythm. The main stance is called the "ginga". It's a triangular patterned movement that keeps the fighter mobile. A technique is executed from the ginga, and it is exited from it as well, creating the "flow" or the "dance" as you would call it.
Capoeira is "played" in a game called a "roda". The object of this game is not to best your opponent by pummeling them to dust, but to display your technique with precision and flow, keeping the game moving.
Even though Capoeira isn't necessarily suited for combat, there are some nasty and brutal techniques in Capoeira that don't exist in any other martial art. However, these techniques never connect because of the very nature of Capoeira in which the object of the game is to keep the dance going. The Escorpianado, in which you roll up onto a handstand, and snap back forward with your legs, is designed to crush your opponent's leg or back as they're sweeping. Of course, this technique is never performed in a roda because it would effectively end the dance. Other effective techniques include the the S-dobrado, armada, parafuso, and mariposa.
On the historical background of the martial art, as someone mentioned before, yes, Capoeira began as a martial art disguised through dance by African slaves. A lot of people associate Capoeira with Brazil however. This is because there are two types of Capoeira. Capoeira Regionale and Capoeira Angola. Capoeira Regionale is the Brazilian form while Capoeira Angola is the original African form. The reason it developed in Brazil is because African slaves were part of the regular slave trade there. Simple as that.
Capoeira Angola tends to be more rustic in nature, based more on dance, music and flow than on flashy movements. Capoeira Regionale on the other hand is all about flair. Spinning kicks, cartwheels, handstands and flips.
Cool clip from a movie demonstrating a scripted fight between a Capoeirista and a Muay Thai fighter.
capoeira is about fighting its just that many dont do it because of fighting. But in its true form it may lok flashy and dance but when they actually fight they can use little or large space they dont jump out flipping they just use the attacks that are masked by them. Why train in capoira if you dont want to fight using it. Also why didnt your maestre teach you how to use the techniques in street combat.
Capoeira isn't really about combat. Some techniques from Capoeira can be assimilated to create an effective martial art, but not Capoeira in itself. Can you win a bar-fight with it? Probably not; most moves take time and space, though some techniques are very effective and resemble San Shou take-downs.
Capoeira is a game. Though it does incorporate combat, it's more akin to a game or dance. Think Dance Dance Revolution. It's a game about dancing, but everyone knows that nobody dances that way; the same with Capoeira, it's a martial art that is performed through dance, but no one fights that way.
Capoeira is about rhythm. The main stance is called the "ginga". It's a triangular patterned movement that keeps the fighter mobile. A technique is executed from the ginga, and it is exited from it as well, creating the "flow" or the "dance" as you would call it.
Capoeira is "played" in a game called a "roda". The object of this game is not to best your opponent by pummeling them to dust, but to display your technique with precision and flow, keeping the game moving.
Even though Capoeira isn't necessarily suited for combat, there are some nasty and brutal techniques in Capoeira that don't exist in any other martial art. However, these techniques never connect because of the very nature of Capoeira in which the object of the game is to keep the dance going. The Escorpianado, in which you roll up onto a handstand, and snap back forward with your legs, is designed to crush your opponent's leg or back as they're sweeping. Of course, this technique is never performed in a roda because it would effectively end the dance. Other effective techniques include the the S-dobrado, armada, parafuso, and mariposa.
On the historical background of the martial art, as someone mentioned before, yes, Capoeira began as a martial art disguised through dance by African slaves. A lot of people associate Capoeira with Brazil however. This is because there are two types of Capoeira. Capoeira Regionale and Capoeira Angola. Capoeira Regionale is the Brazilian form while Capoeira Angola is the original African form. The reason it developed in Brazil is because African slaves were part of the regular slave trade there. Simple as that.
Capoeira Angola tends to be more rustic in nature, based more on dance, music and flow than on flashy movements. Capoeira Regionale on the other hand is all about flair. Spinning kicks, cartwheels, handstands and flips.
Cool clip from a movie demonstrating a scripted fight between a Capoeirista and a Muay Thai fighter.
capoeira is about fighting its just that many dont do it because of fighting. But in its true form it may lok flashy and dance but when they actually fight they can use little or large space they dont jump out flipping they just use the attacks that are masked by them. Why train in capoira if you dont want to fight using it. Also why didnt your maestre teach you how to use the techniques in street combat.
Why train in Capoeira if you don't intend to fight? To play the roda. To play the game. That's what modern Capoeira is. I'm not sure what you think Capoeira is. Capoeira is very much culture oriented and the roda is very much integrated into it, i.e, no roda, no Capoeira.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 47MartialMan
So much for looking for actual fighting....that clip was sad and non-sensical to me.....
It wasn't meant to be serious. I just thought it was kind of cute. You don't see many films incorporate Capoeira in them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sirdarksol
Drimascus, Capoeira was used to deadly effect in uprisings in Brazil. I wouldn't call it ineffective in a fighting situation.
Against... guns? There's records of plantation slaves overtaking the property and killing their masters, but that's few and far between. Additionally, the art was outlawed (it was recognized at this point in history) thus limiting the amount of fighters that could be trained, and in turn limiting the efficacy of any uprising without firearms. Also important to note is that black slaves in America also led successful uprisings. They did not know Capoeira. I think your argument holds bearing towards that Capoeira increased the general martial prowess of a slave, but it wasn't a requirement leading to a successful uprising. With or without it, in other words.
What was once or maybe thought of recently are two different things.....
He knocked other arts, stated that MA was strictly about fighting.
Then seems to point out the current one is is in is ineffective.
I do think any art can be effective if applied and focuses on other aspects/arts.
I believe it is the practitioner playing a role as well as the teacher and art.
If you read my other thread as it was intended, I mentioned that I don't practice Capoeira for the fighting aspect of it. I practice it for the "fun" or "hobby" aspect. What you consider me "knocking" is my classifying a martial art as inefficient in terms of strictly martial combat versus a martial culture, not that it's in some way inferior to one or another martial art.
To be absolutely clear:
Martial Arts is an art form that incorporates a sense of culture and specific discipline based around combat.
Fighting is fighting.
Capoeira can be incorporated via MMA or street fighting, but Capoeira alone is not designed for street fighting in that the very essence (the fundamentals) of Capoeira is performed as a cultural art through music, dance, and the roda (the game).
Quote:
Originally Posted by 47MartialMan
So is it bar/street/MMA-UFC effective?
No. For the reasons above. It's like playing bluegrass with an electric guitar.
Sure, I'm not completely self-taught. I have my fair share of orange belts from Karate, Taekwon Do, and Kungfu. Why don't I invest the time in these classes?
Answer: I practice martial arts to fight.
Not to pay an instructor to teach me about inner qi, discipline, and do stretching exercises for half the class, finishing off with a mock session in front of some hoity-toity judges to go up "a level".
I'm just not interested in the whole "culture" aspect of martial arts. Sorry. I want to hurt my opponents, not play barbies and have a tea party with them.
But yet you say; I practice it for the "fun" or "hobby" aspect.
So those others you had listed could not do the same, yet you hadnt the understanding or perhaps the qualified instructor/instruction of these? So you rather disco dance and kick to raegae? There is music martial art competitions all over.
__________________ What do I know? Since I didn't post my styles or experience, I have no experience, no knowledge, no say.
That post before mine, was that for post counting? How about the one after?
Hey, my post count has the same palaverment tone as anyone elses'
Sure, I'm not completely self-taught. I have my fair share of orange belts from Karate, Taekwon Do, and Kungfu. Why don't I invest the time in these classes?
Answer: I practice martial arts to fight.
Not to pay an instructor to teach me about inner qi, discipline, and do stretching exercises for half the class, finishing off with a mock session in front of some hoity-toity judges to go up "a level".
I'm just not interested in the whole "culture" aspect of martial arts. Sorry. I want to hurt my opponents, not play barbies and have a tea party with them.
But yet you say; I practice it for the "fun" or "hobby" aspect.
So those others you had listed could not do the same, yet you hadnt the understanding or perhaps the qualified instructor/instruction of these? So you rather disco dance and kick to raegae? There is music martial art competitions all over.
I practice martial arts to fight meant:
I assimilate what I can from a specific martial art and utilize it for combat. Not practice the martial art itself. Diametrically however,
I practice capoeira as a martial art means:
I practice capoeira as a hobby, not to fight with.
capoeira is a fighting style that was developed and is still meant for fghting just because most dont train for fighting and such doesnt mean anythin. Most people dont study tai chi to fight but it still was developed to fight and can still be used for such if one is properly trained or has a decent grasp of it.
capoeira is a fighting style that was developed and is still meant for fghting just because most dont train for fighting and such doesnt mean anythin. Most people dont study tai chi to fight but it still was developed to fight and can still be used for such if one is properly trained or has a decent grasp of it.
I disagree, Tai Chi wasnt developed to fight.....
From my observations, now anyone dont take this offensive;
I have seen, from my observations, that people who choose to study Capoeira, actually self-study or dont have a qualified teacher. I've seen many who got their butts beat from several martial artists, per TKD, Shotokan, Judo, Wrestler, Bar Brawler, Football Jock, and Boxer. Seven (7) fights so far with seven different Capoeira stylists.
Again, From my observations, now anyone dont take this offensive;
Most black males study it in order to trace back into a type of heritage roots.
I spoke to a few older black martial artists, past their 50's, who have studied various arts, blended those, and actually travelled to learn African arts far better than Capoeira. (One was a master instructor of my one of my direct instructors - both are black)
Arts like R.A.T., Nuba, Evala, Nguni, Naboot, Akan, Yoruba, Mende, and Hausa (Dambe)
The problem is, instructors in these abroad are hard to find.
Shame, for the martial arts community that they arent as abundant as other martial arts on a global scale.
In honesty, I wouldnt mind studying one of those I have listed in order to be a more verstile/cultural/and well-rounded martial artist.
I can see it now, because I had posted about women, homosexuals, now blacks, those who are looking to circumvent my honest, straight forward, and non-offense intentions to take my meaning out of context.
__________________ What do I know? Since I didn't post my styles or experience, I have no experience, no knowledge, no say.
That post before mine, was that for post counting? How about the one after?
Hey, my post count has the same palaverment tone as anyone elses'
Capoeira anyone?
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