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Other Martial ArtsDiscuss other martial arts here - such as Capoeira, Savate, Fencing, and Western Martial Arts, etc.
I think that theory; 'Capoeira was a martial art disguised as a dance' has really fallen out of favour.
Increasingly I'm hearing (from books and from different teachers) that this theory is now outdated and out of fashion due to evidence which suggests that African slaves in Brazil had many forms of their culture oppressed, including dancing. Therefore, disguising their martial art as a dance would seem to make little sense. Why disguise something outlawed as something else which was also outlawed?
The current belief is that Capoeira was an amalgamation of many forms of African culture, specifically African slave culture. As all forms of cultural expression were oppressed (martial arts, music, dance, acting) slaves would come together in secret underground meetings and practice all the aspects of their culture which were suppressed. Eventually, different elements of these individual things came together (whether this happened naturally or perhaps because the slaves had limited time to gather together is not yet known) to create an early ancestor of the Capoeira Angola we see today.
There you go, that's pretty much I know (for now) on that matter, I can only rely on what I've read, since this research was done by people which much more historical experience and time than me.
So now you know, next time someone says to you "Capoeira was a martial art disguised as a dance" get a wet fish, slap them round the face* and tell them, "well that theory is probably not true because..." etc
*wet fish slapping optional
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Ah, Steven Seagull, I bet nobody's thought of that before.
The only explanation I can think to combat this is: that slaves were disguising something very illegal as something less illegal.
Also the aspect of dance/art may also come from a 'lets roll as much of our culture into one easily practicable thing as we can so we can practice as much of it as possible with our limited time' sort of mind set.
Not surprising to hear that Capoeira was done in secret since so many others were as well.
The only explanation I can think to combat this is: that slaves were disguising something very illegal as something less illegal.
Also the aspect of dance/art may also come from a 'lets roll as much of our culture into one easily practicable thing as we can so we can practice as much of it as possible with our limited time' sort of mind set.
Not surprising to hear that Capoeira was done in secret since so many others were as well.
I wish that the slaves from pre-civil war (U.S.) would have Capoeira'd those slaveholders butt's and got free sooner.
The only explanation I can think to combat this is: that slaves were disguising something very illegal as something less illegal.
Well, all forms of slave culture were equally oppressed since they were seen by the the slave owners as dangerous things which would stir up unrest amoung the slaves. By banning all forms of expression the slave owners crushed the will of the slaves and made them (to the slave owners eyes) more passive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chapel
Also the aspect of dance/art may also come from a 'lets roll as much of our culture into one easily practicable thing as we can so we can practice as much of it as possible with our limited time' sort of mind set.
Exactly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Militis
I wish that the slaves from pre-civil war (U.S.) would have Capoeira'd those slaveholders butt's and got free sooner.
Unfortunately for them, they probably hadn't heard of Capoeira. Although that is another thing: Capoeira probably wasn't used very much at all to defeat slave owners during the uprisings. Arsen, rioting and the fact there were a lot of slaves compared to slave owners probably got people futher.
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Ah, Steven Seagull, I bet nobody's thought of that before.
From what I have heard, Martial Arts were banned in European Colonies in The Americas... Thats why they called Capoeira a dance, so that they would not be killed or put in jail. So in public, Capoeira was a dance, secretly, it was practiced as a Martial Art.
From what I have heard, Martial Arts were banned in European Colonies in The Americas... Thats why they called Capoeira a dance, so that they would not be killed or put in jail. So in public, Capoeira was a dance, secretly, it was practiced as a Martial Art.
This is what I've heard, but I could be wrong...
Erm, the whole point of this thread was to show that the whole martial art disguised as a dance theory is now considered incorrect.
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Ah, Steven Seagull, I bet nobody's thought of that before.
From what my capoeira instructor's says is that
no one really knows the history because it wasn't recorded
very well.
Also - if you ask some angola capoeiristas they will tell you it's completely african and has no brazilian influences. Others (regional) say different.
Bottom line is who really knows BUT me being a white guy
I was told by my instructor that I couldn't get into some capoeira schools because of my ethnicity.
From what my capoeira instructor's says is that
no one really knows the history because it wasn't recorded
very well.
Also - if you ask some angola capoeiristas they will tell you it's completely african and has no brazilian influences. Others (regional) say different.
Bottom line is who really knows BUT me being a white guy
I was told by my instructor that I couldn't get into some capoeira schools because of my ethnicity.
Why? What's your ethnicity?
Precisely, which is why I made sure I said 'theories' and didn't try and take too many things as fact.
I've had some angola capoeiristas say similar things to me. I've always thought if capoeira was entirely African in origin, why didn't capoeria or anything similar spring up to all the countries Africans slaves were being exported to? Why is it synonymous with Brazil only?
Anyway, good to see another Capoeirista on the forums, welcome!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 47MartialMan
It was disguised as a dance and remained a dance until some person decided that they needed a martial art to represent their culture.
There are many other African martial arts far better than a dance one.
Was it? How do you know that? You understand I'm not going to just take your word as fact.
A bit of a sweeping statement, have you tried all the African martial arts? What do you think makes them better and why?
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Ah, Steven Seagull, I bet nobody's thought of that before.
I am white - thus my capoeira name is Alemao...funny huh
I was told that there was a certain capoeira angola school in Dallas that if any white people tried their class they basically "worked them too hard" to make them not come back.
That meaning they were rough with them.
Ha ha, that's a good one, you don't play a lot of football as well do you?
Ah, that's a shame, I'm very white as well, although then again, so is everyone at my local(ish) angola group. I don't train with them though.
Nope - no football for me.
Oh yeah - do you hate it everytime you hear a Mazda commercial use that "zoom zoom" music? It drives me crazy that they stole that from capoeira and no one even knows where it came from.
Oh yeah - do you hate it everytime you hear a Mazda commercial use that "zoom zoom" music? It drives me crazy that they stole that from capoeira and no one even knows where it came from.
Nah, not really, I just make sure whenever I hear it I add the capoeira lyrics on the end, the way it should be sung.
Drives my sister mental, she hates capoeira with a passion.
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Ah, Steven Seagull, I bet nobody's thought of that before.
I am white - thus my capoeira name is Alemao...funny huh
I was told that there was a certain capoeira angola school in Dallas that if any white people tried their class they basically "worked them too hard" to make them not come back.
That meaning they were rough with them.
Capoeira Mythbusting
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